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It's time to man-up, or woman-up, as the case may be.  State your simple support here, dealers and vendors, with one word:  Yes to TrueCar or No to TrueCar.  I'm tired of this whiney B.S. blamed on fairness--but maybe I'm wrong.  Maybe there is great support of this company?  Or maybe the message of the company is lousy?  Who knows.  YOU DO.  TrueCar, yes or no.  Can you say it in one word?

Me:  NO.  


What say YOU?

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Comment by James A. Ziegler on December 21, 2011 at 4:38pm




IMPORTANT NOTICE: Brokering Prohibition – True Car/ZAG

To:      The Members of the Kansas Automobile Dealers Association
From:  Don L. McNeely, President
Various models for motor vehicle sales programs have brought increased attention on marketing practices in Kansas and across the country.  Commentators have most recently focused upon such programs as that offered by TrueCar/ZAG though there are many forms under which a dealer may be functioning, particularly in online arrangements.  This comment will focus upon how such programs can actually unwittingly or otherwise set you up for possible violations of the Kansas Dealers and Manufacturers Licensing Act, particularly those declaring motor vehicle brokering illegal in Kansas. 
It is KADA’s opinion that the manner in which programs such as that offered by the True Car program as it is currently structured and being offered in our state do in fact violate the Kansas brokering prohibition.  This is particularly so as it relates to a dealership paying a direct marketing fee, which can be likened to a commission, for each vehicle sold. While it is not unlawful to pay an annual or monthly advertising or subscription fee for vehicle leads, it is a violation of the Kansas brokering law to pay a third party a fee—or other benefit--for bringing buyer and seller together.  
It is our understanding that a number of Kansas franchised new car and truck dealers are currently doing business utilizing the TrueCar/Zag format.  It is also our understanding that several formal complaints have been filed with the Kansas Department of Revenue’s Division of Motor Vehicles requesting an investigation of those dealers who have been identified.
As a reminder, the Kansas broker prohibition statute was enacted in 1990 and was ultimately upheld by the Kansas Supreme Court in 1992 (Blue v. McBride).  K.S.A. 2010 Supp. 8-2404 (q), (r), and (u) which respectively pertain to new and used vehicle brokering describe prohibited and allowed practices and exceptions (display, advertising, soliciting and acting as a broker).  These are also discussed and tempered in the McBride case to allow for the free exchange of information, but one must still keep in mind that brokering practices are squarely prohibited.  
You have to pay attention to the laundry list set forth in the law.  It defines a broker to be any person who, for a fee, commission, money, other thing of value, valuable consideration or benefit, either directly or indirectly, arranges or offers to arrange a transaction involving the sale of a vehicle, or is engaged in the business of (1) selling or buying vehicles for other persons as an agent, middleman or negotiator; or (2) bringing buyers and sellers of vehicles together, unless excepted.  (See K.S.A. 2010 Supp. 8-2401(x).)  As you can see the arrangements that are prohibited forms of brokering describe many elements of the TrueCar program which you should review carefully before engaging in such practices. 
Another thing we have heard expressed about marketing arrangements are concerns related to legal issues of privacy, data use and ownership, as well as data access, particularly where a dealer has given outside access by a unrelated third party to its DMS system.  The TrueCar/ZAG structure serves as a significant example of the issue.  It collects transactional data from supposedly various sources to determine “the right price” to pay for a car.  Vehicle pricing points aren’t necessarily the only issue, though.  KADA is of the opinion that this can be ve

Comment by Scott Falcone on December 15, 2011 at 8:32pm

Vaya con dios de automobile (not sure if that is right muchacho, but you get the idea). 

Comment by Keith Shetterly on December 15, 2011 at 7:07pm

Oh, and by the way, for the record, it is still

Me:  NO.  


Comment by Keith Shetterly on December 15, 2011 at 7:06pm

Okay, so the call will be tomorrow 3pm Central.  My approach, I promise, will be simple and direct.  At TrueCar's insistence, I can record the call but cannot broadcast it live.  I insisted STRONGLY to no avail.  Update afterwards.

Comment by Stanley Esposito on December 15, 2011 at 3:33pm
Comment by Stan Sher on December 15, 2011 at 11:51am

People have been bugging me all day yesterday and making jokes like "are you laying around Painter's pool" or "did Painter send you to sleep with the fishes".  Well I was out of town for two days getting my work done.  I cannot be lurking and commenting every 5 minutes as I actually am a busy person.  So I shared my piece of mind as aggravated as I was.  I am back in the home office for a few days so I will continue to work and be a part of this revolution.

Comment by James A. Ziegler on December 15, 2011 at 5:58am

People have been asking why I haven't posted more on these blogs in the last few days?  Well, as you are about to see, I've been doing some things behind the scenes that are about to fall like a row of dominoes... Watch and smile the next few days/weeks and you'll see the handiwork JIM

Comment by Keith Shetterly on December 15, 2011 at 5:54am
Comment by James A. Ziegler on December 15, 2011 at 5:54am

Group 1 booting TrueCar, This is only the beginning, I predict in the next few days we will see several of A-Tier manufacturers, import and domestic, following the VW example and booting TrueCar ... next watch and see the relationship with USAA and AMEX deteriorate as consumer complaints stack up with the better business bureaus and government regulators possibly taking a deep look. Look for investors to run for cover as this deal turns sour. Just my opinion of course, I might be wrong...Let's see. 

Comment by James A. Ziegler on December 15, 2011 at 5:53am

Everyone needs to look at the wards articles... Ruggles could you post a link around the blogs please?

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