Mark Boyd Betrays ADM Members? Is He Guilty? What's Your Opinion?

OK, heres the deal; Mark Boyd is an automotive digital marketing success story that I have not only befriended over the years, but whom I have come to admire and respect. So, when he recently posted an article on ADM as a blog, I did something that I reserve for only the best authors, topics and relevant issues of concern or interest. I used the ADM membership list to invite over 2,500 ADM members to comment and respond to Mark's ADM blog posting... Many of you responded to Mr. Boyd's Blog article seeking comments regarding Craigslist, or you attempted to do so. I WANT TO PERSONALLY AND EMPHATICALLY THANK THE DOZENS OF ADM MEMBERS WHO RESPONDED OR ATTEMPTED TO RESPOND AFTER MARK DELETED THE ARTICLE.

However, it turns out that Mark Boyd's posting of his article on ADM, and subsequent deletion of the article after the ADM member invitation was sent out was a mistake.

As are many other ADM members, I am a member and supporter of David Kain's KainAutomotive.com Idea Exchange, and I know in my heart that David Kain would never waste his time facilitating a process of diverting ADM member traffic to his site, because he already has it! In fact, the ADM Tool Bar which members can install for free has links to, and streams descriptions of activity on the KainAutomotive.com Idea Exchange, along with DealerRefresh activity and ADM member activities. David, Jeff and I enjoy a genuinely friendly relationship with each other, we support each other's endeavors and each of us has a high level of personal and professional respect for each other.

Here are the facts:
After Mark Boyd published the following article (summary shown) on ADM:
"Mark Boyd added a blog post 22 hours ago
Selling on Craigslist - Amazing results or not?
I would be very interested to hear from dealers IF you post your inventory online to Craigslist (and other free listings) and what kind of results you are having? How are you doing it (a software tool, or using a service). Also, If you DON'T ... "

Out of respect for Mr. Boyd, I responded to his plea for feedback about Craiglist by sending out my own personally worded invitations to over 2,500 ADM members... I described Mr. Boyd as an Automotive Digital Marketing Pioneer, I requested that ADM members show professional respect for him by responding to his Blog Article... And, ADM members began to immediately respond in droves.

But, something went wrong... After the first several ADM members entered their comments providing Mr. Boyd with the feedback he requested, Mark Boyd DELETED HIS ADM BLOG POST. This caused further traffic from the alert that was sent to ADM members to reach a dead end when they tried to respond... Which is annoying and could potentially hurt our community by discouraging ADM members from responding to future requests. As bad as it was to have an invitation to respond to a blog article that no longer existed, things got worse...

Less than 9 hours later AN INVITATION WAS SENT OUT BY KAINAUTOMOTIVE.COM IDEA EXCHANGE TO COMMENT ON THE EXACT SAME MARK BOYD WRITTEN ARTICLE POSTED ON THE KAINAUTOMOTIVE.COM IDEA EXCHANGE WEBSITE! The screen capture of the ADM invite below was received in my Outlook Email AFTER I arrived in Rhode Island, at 12:48 AM, but hours after I sent the same ADM invitation while still in Phoenix, a copy of which most of you should have in your inboxes (or junk mail folders) as well:

The KainAutomotive.com invitation to respond to Mark Boyd's article was sent out after ADM members were invited, but also after Mark Boyd deleted his ADM version of the same article... Here's the screen capture of the KainAutomotive.com invite I received in my GMail account, sent AFTER Mark Boyd deleted his ADM post:

Was this some sort of attempt to divert ADM members to the Kain site instead of the ADM site to comment on this article? That was my original perspective, but after speaking with Mark Boyd i am convinced that he made a Mistake. ... After all, why would Mark Boyd delete his article after so many ADM members had already responded to it? You can see the ADM member comments on Mark Boyd's ADM Profile page that were made before he removed the article from ADM. According to Mark, he was well aware that ADM members were responding to his article at the very same time he was trying to make spelling corrections. Which is when he accidentally deleted it. I have no reason to suspect Mark would ever lie to me about such a matter..

My question is this... Did I over-react by believing that the timing and series of events indicated some type of treachery to the ADM members who were invited to respond to his blog article on Craigslist?

Does deleting an ADM article less than 24 hours after 2,500 ADM members get invited to that very same article, resulting in a dead link (now redirected to the ADM blog listing) qualify as being inconsiderate to ADM members?

If you were in my position, what would YOU have thought about Mark Boyd's article deletion?

Tags: betrays adm, craigslist, mark boyd, mark boyd craigslist

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Replies to This ADM Discussion

Permalink Reply by Mike Warwick on June 1, 2009 at 7:07pm: In the spirit of fairness, Mr. Boyd should be given the obligatory 24 hours to respond. In the absence of a response, he should immediately be banished. As a member of both communities, I saw what transpired in real time and was amazed that someone was attempting such an obvious transgression. Hopefully, there is a less sinister explanation but it doesn't look promising.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Ralph Paglia on June 4, 2009 at 9:20pm: Mike,

Thank you very much for chiming in... I was worried that my mind was playing tricks on me, and based on my genuine friendship with Mark Boyd, I thought that maybe the 80 hour work weeks had caught up with me and I was starting to incur paranoid delusions. Regardless of the explanation, it is nice to know that somebody else caught the events playing out within the time and sequence described. I have so much respect for both Mark Boyd (well, up until 3 hours ago) and David Kain... This is something i have a VERY hard time accepting. I feel like i did when my girlfriend started cheating on me with one of my fraternity brothers in college... Not sure who is at fault, but i do know that I feel like Mark betrayed BOTH me and our, yes OUR, community here at ADM.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Mike Warwick on June 1, 2009 at 7:49pm: I've noticed similar posts on both forums but nothing quite like this. My first thought was that someone had approached both you and David for a favor to gather this info on Craig's List but when I went back to see if it was the same person asking for our input, the post was removed. That got me thinking that something was rotten in Denmark. I wasn't sure if I was imagining what had happened but from your subtle post, I can see that I wasn't alone. I'm just surprised that it was done so deliberately.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by David Kain on June 1, 2009 at 7:54pm: Hi Ralph,

I don't know what got this all stirred up but I promise I did not have any part in a plan to drive people to our Idea Exchange. You know you can take me at my word Ralph. Mark made a post on the Idea Exchange and we sent out a note to tell people it was on there just like we do when we receive other posts. I assumed it was an innocent post. You and I have talked about our Idea Exchange and the fact that we are not competitors and that our little exchange is not designed to be anything like your Automotive Digital Marketing site. I actually learned about Ning from an article I read in Fast Company and as you know we operated a Google Group and still do and it is just for the fun of it and a way to learn.

Ralph, you have an extraordinary thing going with your ADM site and I admire what you have created as it has become a remarkable resource for the industry. Please take me at my word, I did not assist Mark in any way shape or form to drive people to our Idea Exchange. I know Mark well and I do not think he would attempt to do that either. We have a nice little exchange and would like to keep it that way.

Your friend,

David Kain; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Ralph Paglia on June 1, 2009 at 8:20pm: David,

Of course, I would take your word before taking a check from anyone else! You are one of the pillars of ethics and moral responsibility in this industry. Thank you for weighing in, as I was speaking with Mark Boyd on the phone... Basically, if Mark Boyd is guilty of something here, it is of being clumsy with his blogging technique. According to Mark, he was trying to correct spelling errors after I sent the invitation out to his blog, and when he copied and pasted his corrections into the KainAutomoitve.com Idea Exchange, he thought those corrections would flow through to ADM, because he thought your site was a "subset of ADM", which we all know is not true! I explained that your site, ADM and thousands of other communities are built on the Ning platform, that Ning is like the Linux of community content management systems... You can pay for some features, or run the free version supported by advertising. Anyways, I am sure that Mark simply goofed up and I, on the other hand, reacted like the Italian Produce Man from Buffalo, NY that always will be at my core, and started swinging before being able to ask Mark questions... As they say; "My Bad!"

Mr. Kain, I respectfully ask your forgiveness if I offended you in any way... I hope that most readers would see that my intent was never to impute you or your community, of which I am a proud member and supporter. I routinely reference and send people to KainAutomotive.com Idea Exchange, and occasionally take time out to participate and respond to Kain members, sharing what i have come to see as best practices.

Thank you for being so kind as to respond to this dialogue, and once again, I apologize if I offended you in any way... It also did not help that in my new iPhone, I could not find mark's numbers as my hands shook in anger and i was trying to call him... So, out came the poison pen! (ah, actually a keyboard); ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by David Kain on June 1, 2009 at 8:37pm: Ralph,

You are a trip. After being raised with 5 brothers I have seen a lot of "quick to anger and quick to cool"situations. You are the BEST.

Thanks for keeping it real.

David; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Ralph Paglia on June 1, 2009 at 8:46pm: David,

You can rest assured that there will never be a dull moment when i am around! If you talk to people who worked with me in dealerships, they would tell you that they have never seen anybody get customers so angry, and then see those same customers so in love with me an hour later!

My favorite way to handle "heat" was to convince the angry customer to come to work for the dealership to help us straighten everything out... Sometimes, we would end up hiring the customer's son, daughter, cousin, in-law or whoever, and the people who made the most noise as "Heaters" always sent in the most sales and service referrals when they or their family came to work for us.

Yes... I get angry fast, calm quickly, and my love is forever... Including the ex wives! And, I am deeply passionate about most anything I consider important enough to commit myself to. Including this community!

That's why all advertising revenue is given back to ADM members in various ways, including receptions at Digital Dealer... And, David, we will be saving a special VIP spot for you at the next ADM Digital Dealer Reception! (videographers, stand by...); ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Clarence U Romero on June 3, 2009 at 8:29pm: David, I had to read this post till the end. I could not put it in my mind that you, or Mark would intentionally do something of this nature. I am glad I read this, and heard all sides, you’re a class act David. I admire your work.

Clarence
RedNumbat.com; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Clarence U Romero on June 3, 2009 at 8:33pm: Ralph, I am glad you, David, and Mark worked things out.

Clarence
RedNumbat.com; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Mike Warwick on June 1, 2009 at 8:07pm: The thought never crossed my mind that David would have anything to do with trying to steal ADM members. As David wrote, his Idea Exchange is a very different resource and would never be construed as a competitor to ADM. The Idea Exchange is a much narrower group of E-Commerce professionals who share ideas and best practices. An even narrower group would be the members of Brian Pasche's forum. All three serve very different purposes and it's clear to me that each creator's intent was not to compete with ADM. As for Mr. Boyd, my hope is that this can be cleared up with a timely response.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Mike Warwick on June 1, 2009 at 8:39pm: Voila! Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. Getting back to the issue of the day - is anyone concerned that the governments backing and endless supply of cash to GM is going to negatively impact Ford? I don't think Ford has been given enough credit for doing things the right way and with GMAC being granted holding company / bank status, they were given TARP money and promptly started offering 0% financing for 60 and 72 months. My feeling is that everything the government touches turns to sh*t but will they just continue to pump cash into GM at the expense of Ford? What's next 0% for 84 months, 96? Ford would like nothing more than to set it's sights on Toyota and Honda but government interference might make that impossible.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Sally Lawrence on June 1, 2009 at 8:17pm: As much as I hate to think that Mark or David would have done this...it appears that they did...it's pretty obvious actually by the dates/times and behaviors...

I'd be careful how much friendship you lent him in the future and keep it professional.; ▶ Reply to This

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